SOUND MEETS STORY | LINDSAY GRAHAM

Podcasting has been around for 20 years, but it has been in the last 10 years where there have been a number of platforms, series, and networks that everyone talks about. Whether you’re into True Crime, Reality, Business, TV Commentary, etc there is a genre there to suit your interests. In the last 6 or so years, we came across Lindsay Graham who’s shows forcus on historial, business, and variations of True Crime as it pertains to history and/or business.

For years, we have heard his voice as he talks about various times in history and businesses that we engage with. We sat down with him to talk about his array of successful series, the final episodes of Business Movers, his production company Airship, how he came to his partnership with Wondery and his thoughts on podcasting as an industry that continues to eovolve.

ATHLEISURE MAG: It’s definitely a pinch me moment as we have enjoyed listening to your and your portfolio of podcasts for years!

We can’t remember which podcasts we started listening to that you created, but we think it was American Scandal with its first season which focused on BALCO. We tend to listen to shows that focus on True Crime and business so the intersectionality of those verticals is what drew us into that season and ultimately enjoying the other ones as well.

Before we start to delve into your podcasts. What is your background and how did you get into the podcast industry?

LINDSAY GRAHAM: It was by total accident! I have no business doing what I am doing right now. By education, I have an MBA in Marketing right?

AM: Right!

LG: So that is what I was doing for most of my working life really. I worked in non-profit marketing and I also worked in an insurance company. It was at that insurance company when I got fired and that was fine because I didn’t like them either. But as you can tell, you notice the guitars over my shoulder here, I have always been interested in music and in audio. I guess my dream job would have been Record Producer.

So, I have this little studio that I am still in. I thought after this moment of losing my job, I went to my wife and said, why don’t I try and do something with my life that I actually enjoy? So I tried. I cofounded a little audiobook company based out of Dallas here.

We put out a lot of audiobooks, but along the way that caught the attention of Hernan Lopez who was the Founder and CEO of a very young company called Wondery at the time.

One of the best decisions that I ever made in my life was that because it was a fictional show and because we were ad sponsored, we didn’t have a host. Most podcast ads are host read ads. So I decided to be the host! I figured that I would put my marketing degree to work. Well Hernan just really enjoyed how I wrote and read my ads. Then even though I gave up that audiobook company and crawled back to the world of Marketing, Hernan called me up and said, “hey, I’ve got this problem. We have a brand new podcast coming out and it’s hosted by a journalist who can’t do personal endorsements – would you do it? It’s called Dirty John.” In the same phone call, he also asked if I was a history buff and would I want to host and sound design a new concept for a show there that they were calling American History Tellers. I like to joke that these are not questions that you want to say no to! You say yes to all of them!

AM: Exactly.

LG: So I did! All of a sudden, I was a podcaster, but I was a part-time podcaster. There was no way that I was going to suddenly quit my job again and go back to this fantasy world of being in audio. So for a long time, I did History Tellers part-time on nights and weekends and it was rough with a full-time job, and a young daughter at home. But it was really rewarding and I was actually making more money then I was at my day job. So I said, “I’m not going to quit for 1 podcast. But what if I had 2? Because then I can distribute the risk and it’s a portfolio of revenue. So I went back to Wondery and I said that I had an idea for American Scandal. It’s very much so the formula of American History Tellers show but leans into the True Crimeish, but not so True Crime. They bought the rights to that show – I really wish that I didn’t sell all of it because who knows and who knew how successful it would be? But what I did was secure my place in podcasting. I had 2 successful chart topping shows with a young network on the make and I got to quit the day job to become a full-time podcaster.

Yeah, I’m here by accident sort of, but you take the reigns at some point.

AM: Your podcasts have gotten us through running around the city, heading to events, coming from showrooms, heading to set, navigating layouts for when the issue is about to drop and more! We started listening in 2018/2019, so for a period of time we were able to just go from one season to the next in a number of series. The sound production is just incredible. As a Telecom major with a focus in production, my ears are always enjoying the audio quality in each episode.

LG: Thank you! We put a lot of effort into it and I guess that is the audio background coming to the fore right?

AM: Exactly.

What are the kinds of stories that you are drawn to when you are coming up with the different podcasts? Are there subjects that you naturally lean towards?

LG: Yeah. At this point, these shows are run by talented and sort of medium sized teams. So, I don’t even know some of the topics that are being worked on until they are really far down the pike. But in the beginning when it was a smaller endeavor and we were all working together to try to figure this thing out, the thing that was most helpful was to try to find the central question of the rubric that this show is centered around. What is the kernel? For American History Tellers, we put you in the shoes of everyday ordinary people as history is being made. That’s kind of what we are trying to do. We try to stay out of the Halls of Power as much as we can. It’s not all Oval Office and Congressional floor. We really do try to put you at the kitchen table of when these things are happening. So that’s what makes that show special and when we started, it was a good question – what do we start with? What should be our debut topic? This was early on in the first Trump administration. If you remember, there were these weird sabor rattling moments with North Korea and Putin. I thought that we should remind the American public about the Cold War and how terrifying it was for a lot of people especially us Gen Xers who had to hide under our desks or whatever to some how avoid a nuclear apocalypse – that was going to protect us.

AM: They were thick tables!

LG: Oh yeah!

But it was always how did this affect the average American at that time and how does that reverberate now?

American Scandal was actually pretty similar although this one is very POV centered show. We follow certain characters and we try to anchor it in their perspective. It always comes down to and I think this is why it is such a character driven show because that is what we try to bring to that show.

All of my shows have some sort of center or central question to them that we use as sort of a touchstone to remind us of how we are telling the story.

AM: Where do you start creatively whether it’s a new season or an entirely new podcast series. What do you do when you may have such wide lanes?

LG: There are editorial discussions and marketing considerations like Oct is around the corner, do we have a spooky story? We’re in the media business so we try to do our best with calendarization and things like that.

How do we tell is to our audience in a manner that adds value to someone who may know a lot about it and is also unique to us and I think that that is how we go about it. We get so many suggestions from our listeners, our writers, and our researchers, and they don’t just quite fit.

AM: Tell us about Airship. How did it start and what are all the podcasts and projects that are involved in this company.

LG: So Airship is my production company that I founded really to just house my increasing podcast activities right? So it started with American History Tellers, then once American Scandal came along, then American Elections Wicked Game, then 1865, then History Daily, and so I knew that I needed a structure.

It’s a small podcast production company. We do our best to keep our output up with our resources lean. At our height, we were putting out 11 episodes a week for my shows and other shows. We kind of specialize in the history niche and we have recently taken over the entire turnkey process of American Scandal so that now includes scripting, that was something that previously Wondery did. So yeah, it’s just a little company that could.

AM: Do you guys have from an American Scandal perspective, do you guys have a soundboard so that people can give feedback? How does that work from thinking about a topic and making it an actual season?

LG: Yes, I have a critical employee, my Chief of Content, William Simpson, he actually works in the UK. A lot of that gets filtered to him first. So, all of the ideas will go into some document and we’ll get some form of vetting together. It does require some fair amount of effort to see which of these stories has the legs. We’re not in the enviable position to do any original reporting – we’re not diving into the archives with a weekly show or 4 or 5 weekly shows – how could you?

We need to rely on the existing reporting and the existing sources and that still requires a lot of effort to find out what’s out there and to validate it as well as we take truth telling very seriously. We want to make sure that the story can be told without bias. But then there are considerations of how we can tell the story that is unique to us. I have writers, a bunch of freelance writers, I have freelance showrunners and producers, I have my Chief of Content, I’m involved all of the time – it will all go through it’s filtering and funneling process and then we will come up with ideas.

AM: I love History Tellers and I also love History Daily. I’m always amazes about some item or event that happened on this day that I didn’t know about. How do you decide that? There doesn’t seem to be overlap and there is a new fact to uncover and listen to for that day.

LG: Well the good thing about history is that it is pretty old! There has been a lot of days. Even though that is true, I will back up and say that since you have listened to it, you realize that there is a recency bias. There’s a lot more 20th century stuff than there is 19th century stuff and that is again because of sourcing and other things. We don’t know what really happened in 4500BC – no one was writing it down, but I’m sure it was interesting. The point remains that so much was happening that we have the entire globe to cover! This isn’t American History Daily, it’s History Daily. We don’t choose days like this person was born or this person died. Those aren’t actually interesting days that’s just kind of an anniversary of something – it’s what that person did in their life that’s important. So we have all sorts of options. We get to find a date, anchor an episode around that date, but also storytell from both sides of that date. We’re not just a page a day kind of calendar that gives you a sentence or 2 on what happened.

AM: We’re bummed that Business Movers will end at the end of this month. It was really a series that we have enjoyed listening to as it is in that vein of The Men Who Built America on History Channel and those kinds of docuseries are always fascinating and it’s great to be able to deep dive into those companies and industries. How did that podcast come about and what do you want the legacy to be for that particular series?

LG: To tell you how these things get decided, their Sales team said that they were selling the crap from their business program ming. “Does Lindsay have any interest in a business show?” I thought it was perfect because I have a business degree as I’m a history podcaster with a business degree so the ingredients for that show started pulling together. Talking about the rubic or the central kernel of that show, that one has always been as I have articulated – there is a Character, a Crisis, and a Business Concept. In every episode, we will explore those 3 things. This character dealing with this crisis as it relates to this business concept. We’re not explicit about that, like we’re talking about inventory management or inflationary pressures or whatever the business concept is. Hopefully you pick it up and under every single episode, it is there. Can I just tell you that I had some of the most fun in that show because the personalities are so big, so dynamic, and they are consequential in our everyday lives. There is not a company that we covered that you don’t have some sort of personal relationship with whether it’s Disney, or Pepsi, or Microsoft. Even the ones that you think didn’t touch your lives, you would be captured by their journey as well. It was a fun show and I really enjoyed it. I am sad that it reached its end.

AM: We saw it on your LinkedIn when you announced it and that’s what made us reach out after being long time listeners! We listen to it to as there are so many nuggets to learn and apply it to things that we are working on or how we engage with other businesses. A number of those businesses have been those that we have worked or partnered with and it was great to hear things that we may not have known about their backstory or event looking ahead to where they planned to go. It was an enjoyable and invaluable podcast that will be missed for sure.

LG: Thank you very much, that is exactly the reaction that I would hope for from my listeners. That it is entertaining, but also surprisingly useful resource.

AM: 1865, we don’t know how we found out about it, it could have been a cross promotional episode that was somewhere else or an ad but it was enthralling to listen to, the sound, the voices – super immersive! How did this come about and what was your involvement in it?

LG: That came on the heels of the very first podcast of the fictionalized presidential elections so a friend of mine who was living in LA and he’san actor and writer and was trying to make things work, he had a play about 1865. It focused a little more on John Wilks Booth, but he had an idea for an adaptation and was pitching it around Hollywood to try and get a TV series. He heard Terms which was the audio drama that I made, and said why don’t we make an audio drama around this subject. It worked perfectly as I was already making a brand around history podcasts so we decided to partner on that and he is the Co-Creator and Head Writer of that show and I am the Co-Executive Producer as well as I composed all the music and did the sound design of that show as well.

AM: It was incredible to listen to and an audible delight.

LG: Well thank you again! Audible delight – I like it! Well it was a real labor of love. It tells a very important story that starts with the assassination of Abraham Lincoln and the immediate first days of Reconstruction and how difficult this period will be without Lincoln around. It is semi-dramatized, but everything that is said in there is true.

AM: Are there upcoming podcasts that you are able to share to keep an eye out? There are probably 5 names whether it’s the host or a production company but when I see them pop into my feed or I’m aware of a project that is coming up from them I follow immediately because if I hear your name or Airship I know it will be something I will enjoy from an audio perspective as well as the subject that is being presented.

LG: Probably not -

AM: That’s what we thought you would say.

LG: Nothing is fully greenlit at this point. The uncertainty at Wondery has certainly made it difficult to announce or do anything for sure right now. The changing nature of the podcast industry has also altered how I view my work. So, I don’t know. It’s not even a matter of us vetting it with legal yet. It’s a little uncertain right now. However, I will guarantee that there will be more stuff from me and my partners in the next 12-18 months.

AM: That’s great!

Just as you said, the podcasting landscape – I mean this industry has been around for quite some time. There are many people that feel that they can just jump in and make a podcast and that is debatable. But for those who do want to embark in this area, what are some tips that you have regardless of their genre – what are things that they should be thinking of?

LG: The barrier to entry to not just podcasting but to a bunch of New Media – short form video, or you could sign up for Substack right now and have a paid newsletter. All of it remains the same I think. There are tactics for hooking people or marketing to them and extracting economic value from their audience and I think that the only way to do that is in a world of increasing authenticity is to be yourself or to do what you do. You may not know what you do, and that is a hard question to answer and I don’t know if I have the fullest idea of what I do. No one is going to have a career if they approximate viral moments or they just start replicating other success. If you think back in every piece of media that is hailed as something worthwhile or is a watershed piece, it has no resemblance to what came before it, it broke the mold, it changed things, or twisted things or was so outrageously original that is forced itself into the world. I’m not saying that you have to be so violently original, but you do have to be authentic. In a moment where we are all reckoning with AI and it’s very slippery and seductive inauthenticity. I think that we will more and more be drawn to these small and obviously human moments.

AM: 100%.

Do you have any podcasts that you enjoy listening to?

LG: Here’s the secret!

AM: We know where this is going, but we just wanted to hear it directly from you ha!

LG: Once you make podcasts and enough podcasts for 8-10 hours a day, I drive home with the radio off. I really appreciate just the silence of driving home. That doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy podcasts, I’m just not the inveterate consumer that you might think that I am.

You know, I once visited a very famous celebrity chef at his home and his refrigerator was filled with champagne and an expired tin of caviar and nothing else!

AM: Yup!

LG: I think that there is a certain bit of the cobbler’s kids (Editor’s Note: this is a Spanish proverb that means that someone with a specific skill is often so busy assisting others that their own affairs go unattended) here. But Revisionist History is always one that I enjoy. Malcolm Gladwell has an amazing, quirky, and impish way of looking at the world and I just find him captivating. Even if he is wrong about his big point or is demonstratively apprehensive of the facts, it still is really entertaining and thought provoking.

A recent winner in the history podcast universe has been The Rest is History out of the UK. They have hit upon a formula that their parent company has been replicating quite a bit. They came out with The Rest is History and then all of a sudden, there is The Rest is Politics, The Rest is Politics: US, The Rest is Football, The Rest is Entertainment and the formula works! But it is rooted in 2 people who authentically enjoy each other and authentically know what they are talking about even if they just researched it and they are able to bring their own expertise to it. It’s not a new formula of 2 people talking about a subject, that is as old as podcasting. There is something where there is a chemistry between these 2 hosts and the way that they tackle topics is persistently interesting.

AM: Are there subjects that you have yet to tackle that you would love to see in a podcast where it’s a series or just an episode?

LG: I’m sure there are! I mean yes absolutely. I have a document hidden somewhere in the cloud of every single one of these ideas. Just at this moment, I can’t think of any of them!

There is 1 story that I am dying to tell and I do hope that I get to tell it and I want to do it in a live show setting. There was a man named Danny Faulkner that lived here in Dallas. Presumably, he was an illiterate house painter. But he started finding wealth and success in real estate deals and building condos. This is in the mid 80s and all of a sudden, everyone was buying, building, and swapping these condos. A lot of people were getting rich and it’s not surprising that is becomes an entire house of cards and a big Ponzi scheme – trading amongst each other, bidding the price way up there and then selling it to a rube! But, this illiterate house painter was the ring leader of it all and he crashed a bank! He pretty much started the real estate depression of the 1980s and it had a great affect on my family because my father was a home builder and all of a sudden, we had to move out of our house and find a new place.

It’s one of those stories that would be really good for American Scandal because it is very character forward, but it is pretty small and pretty localized, and is not international, but it meant a lot to a lot of people and it has a personal connection to me and that is why I want to do it in a live show setting where I can drive the personal connection!

AM: Wow!

When you were talking about it it sounded like something out of Texas Monthly.

When you’re not working on your podcasts, what do you like doing in your personal time?

LG: I just yesterday saw a clip from the comedian Jimmy Carr, and he was asked, what are your hobbies. He gave this response, “I’m lucky that my work is more fun than anything else than I can think of.”

AM: We have said that on a number of occasions.

LG: That’s kind of, sort of true for me. Of course, I have enough of it, I drive home in silence, I get to come home and spend time with my young daughter who is 11 and my wife. I play guitar. I love to cook. If there is ever a guitar playing cook podcast, I would be ready!

AM: That’s a nice little intersection there.

LG: I live a fairly quiet – well you know what? I’ll tell you this! For the last 7 or 8 weeks, I’ve been taking improv classes!

AM: What, oh wow!

LG: Yeah! Way back in the day, I used to run the tech, sounds, lights, and used to play music for an improv troop. I never got on the stage myself. I enjoyed it then and then I grew up. But recently I thought, I need to for my own benefit grow, step outside of myself, and to be silly! This is terrifying to me to get up on the stage and be silly and put on a voice or to move my body in an odd or awkward way! I don’t dance like no one is watching – that doesn’t make sense to me and I’m not going to dance at all! So I figured that I’m too locked up. So I have been taking this improv class and I have really been enjoying it and I signed up for level 2.

AM: Wow and is the goal to maybe have a small group of family and friends to watch the joys of what you have learned?

LG: No. That’s not the goal. I have enough things that my family and friends can consume if they want to hear what I’m doing. The improv is really just for me and I might get comfortable enough to enjoy it as well from a performance aspect. But it is really a brand new and very rewarding way of thinking.

IG @notthatlindsaygraham

PHOTOGRAPHY COURTESY | Lindsay Graham

Read the AUG ISSUE #116 of Athleisure Mag and see SOUND MEETS STORY | Lindsay Graham in mag.

MANIFESTING THIS LIFE | CANDIACE DILLARD-BASSETT

One of our favorite reality franchises is BRAVO's The Real Housewives. It gives you a glimpse of a city with a group of women that are friends who open up their lives. You find that they are ambitious driven women who navigate their communities. The Real Housewives of Potomac is one of our favorites in this city specific series and when Candiace Dillard-Bassett arrived starting in the 3rd season, we met a woman on a mission who had an array of accolades under her belt while being focused on building her legacy. We talk with her about pageantry, her career prior to being on RHOP, the show, what the platform has provided, her music career and how she continues to give back to others!

ATHLEISURE MAG: In prep for this inter-view, I really liked learning about your background. You grew up with parents who both worked in the Air Force as physicians, graduated from Howard University and you worked in public service at the White House Offices of Public Engagement and Intergovernmental Affairs for President Barack Obama as well as serving as a staffer during his 2012 reelection campaign. Why was it important for you to begin your career in this way in public service?

CANDIACE DILLARD-BASSETT: I know that I grew up in a household that de- manded excellence. I grew up in a household where everyone was a professional. My parents were physicans, they have a military background and they raised me as well as my siblings to model that. They taught us the truth of being people of color in this country, how the world might not always see us in the way that we see ourselves when we’re surrounded by like-minded people who look like us and think like us.

I always tell this story, it’s funny. I wanted to be a doctor, I wanted to be a physician, I started out wanting to be a dermatologist, and I wanted to be an OBGYN. I think I must have gotten to the 9th grade and chemistry, algebra and calculus were kind of kicking my butt and I discovered that these were not my friends, so it let me pivot to something else that I am really good at which is communications. I love publc speaking – I love writing and I love aspects of journalism. I ended up being co-editor of my yearbook and co-editor of my newspaper in high school. I love to read. So, thank God, that I found something else because that math got me!

I want to encourage women who are going out in those fields for STEM because it’s so important and it’s something that we need to have more faces there that look like us there and showcase that representation. I’m a cheerleader and I’m in the back in the hallways saying, “go my STEM sisters!” But it’s just not my ministry. You have to know your strengths.

AM: That’s totally true. I thought about med school and then law school, but then you think about those years and the kinds of studies involved and I just kept continuing to code and work in fashion. But I love seeing those who are deeply involved in STEM and STEAM – all of that! So, you were Miss United States 2013. I never did pageants personally, but I have styled projects with Virginia Limongi Miss Ecuador 2018 ahead of her competing for Miss Universe as well as Nia Franklin Miss America 2019. I love this element of the pageant world as it’s more than looking beautiful as there are these other facets to it. Why was it so important to you that you wanted to do that and how important is that for character building?

CDB: I’m a pageant girl for life. I started competing since I was 5 years old and it was just ingrained in me. I will always speak up and speak about that part of my life because I always want to serve as an example of what it truly looks like to be a product of the pageant industry and of the pageant world as a whole, because there is this stigma – this neg- ative idea attached to women who compete in pageants that we’re dumb, we’re self-absorbed that we are mean – cutting each other’s dresses backstage, cutting lipsticks -

AM: Breaking zippers!

CDB: Yeah all of that stuff!

AM: I was a cheerleader – so yup!

CDB: Same! So you understand! So there’s that Toddlers and Tiaras sort of trope that people always ask me when I say that I have competed in pageants, “oh is it like Toddlers and Tiaras?” I mean, yes there are some aspects of the pageant world that can be superficial and that can be seen in a negative light, but my experience in all my years competing and I have competed a lot, I have always felt uplifted and empowered, seen and heard and loved. It’s where I learned to identify who I was. Where I learned how to brand myself, where I learned how to speak up for my- self and be an advocate – not just for me, but for causes that I believe in. I learned how to communicate those things in a way that was palatable and respectful and made sense to different audiences. I credit my mom and pageantry for all of those things. Some of the most brilliant women that I know – doctors, lawyers, scientists, inventors, dancers – you could not imagine the pedigree that you find in pageantry, and it goes far beyond just smiling, waving and being a robot. That’s only one aspect of the game of the sport because I do feel that it is one. I’m so proud to be part of it!

AM: You also have an agency where you help other people in the pageant system. Can you talk more about that?

CDB: I founded my consulting firm Candiace Dillard Pageant Consulting for the very reasons that I explained. After I won Miss United States, I found myself being a coach on accident – being someone that is empowering women around their pageant journey. It was my director at the time, Laura Clark who is now the director of The Miss Earth United States Organization – she’s a bad B! She’s a bad woman, I love her! My makeup artist at the time, Melissa, we were sitting in the hotel room and I was helping to co-produce a pageant for them one weekend. We were talking about me helping the girls and we were talking and they said, “this is a business – why don’t you start a business?” I was like, “no, why would I do that? I could just help them.” They explained that I could do it for free but when it could be framed as a structured enterprise that has tiers and everything that these women need to truly get the most of this experience by someone that has been through it.

I was like, ok and it was born! I have coached over 500 women to different titles and different places. Obviously have not been as active lately because I can barely keep an eyebrow on!

AM: You’re just a bit busy!

CDB: It’s always something that I go back to. My girls – they’re my friends, my sisters – I call them my pageant sisters. They’ll call me and let me know what’s happening. Even the little girls that I have coached, I have watched them grow up and compete as junior teens and now they’re in the Miss category. They’re like my little babies and they have just flourished. It’s rewarding to see and it’s work that I would do for free.

AM: I think that that’s amazing when you’re able to give back and infuse peo- ple in that way. You’re always going to remember who shined a light on you and to do that across all the people that you have mentored – it’s phenomenal.

CDB: Of yeah, it’s so rewarding and I would do it for nothing – just for fun. You get to play dress up, help women decide who they want to be and you’re doing it with them! It’s like having your own children helping them out and I love opening doors or women who are al- ready so special, intelligent and wise. It’s just giving them that polish and tweak that they need to accomplish their goals in the same way that I was fable to use pageantry to accomplish mine.

AM: I don’t know how you sleep because you also have a successful hairline, Prima Hair Collection by Candiace Dillard. Why did you want to be involved in the hair industry and why are you so passionate about it?

CDB: Prima Hair Collection was really a spin-off of pageantry so I love that you put those questions together. When I was competing coming up in the 90s, it was hard to find hair extensions that worked, were human hair, that came in different lengths, different textures and different colors that worked for me and worked with women that looked like me. We were stuck with synthetic hair or bad weaves or very expensive extensions because there was a monopoly on the market. There are a lot of different hair extension companies that you can choose from now, but I still had a passion for sector of the beauty history. It was my mom who said, “this should be a business.” There’s that theme where it’s always a woman empowering me to see something great for myself. It was my mom this time and she said that we were going to do it. I was like, “really we are, yay!” She helped me do the re-search and she gave me the investment. She purchased my first large order of hair. My sister got involved and 7+ years later, we are a full-service company that does business across the world. We have international clients that will clamor to get Prima hair. We are looking to move into other products soon. I have always seen myself move into other hair care products. I see myself at some point moving into skincare – I love it so much!

AM: I could see that!

CDB: Yes, but that’s really something that I would want to take my time with and find the right people, the right chemist that will ensure I’m putting out the products that I would use myself. But that’s down the road. Right now, Prima Hair is still kicking and we’re moving into other hair products.

AM: I think it’s amazing to hear this. I graduated from college in 2001 and the first 6 to 7 years, I was modeling and what it was like then to model as a Black woman – some people didn’t know how to do my makeup, you brought your own items! When we launched this magazine, 6 years ago I said that it was unacceptable for a hair or makeup person to come to set saying that they couldn’t work with various skin tones and poking around.

CDB: Yeah! We have had to learn to bring our own makeup for ourselves and to do our own hair. Right now, if it’s not one of my own makeup artists, I’m like, “I’m ok, I can do it myself.” You just come conditioned not to feel seen and not to be represented in those spaces.

AM: It’s so sad. We had someone come to set, is super accomplished and she brought 3 bags of her own makeup and it broke my heart. To know that she was known and she still felt the need to do that, I told her that she didn’t have to do that and we had great talent on set. Of course, our MUA killed it but seeing that the feeling still exists even after all of this time – it broke my heart. I always enjoy hearing that people like you and others are doing the good work!

You joined the cast of RHOP in the 3rd season. I already loved it when it first came out and then you stepped on the stage and I was excited as your personality is like my own. What made you see this and want to be part of it?

CDB: So, I can remember – I’m originally from Georgia – when The Real Housewives of Atlanta started, I thought, “oh my God, a show about Atlanta.” I watched with my mom and we were all engrossed in the show and then of course, I went off to college in Howard and then I was living in the DMV which we call the DC, Maryland, Virginia area and my best friend called me and asked I had heard about this new Black Housewives show. I hadn’t, but then I started watching. It was exciting that on a network like BRAVO that is very popular and well known and very much engrossed in pop culture – Atlanta was the premier show for women of color and here we are now with the second iteration of women of color in this franchise. This was exciting. I wanted to know who the girls were and at that time, I had been here for 14 years – a long time. I came to Howard in 2005 and I never left. I wanted to know who was on the show, what they were wearing and where they were going. I was interested and I was watching it with my boyfriend at the time, Chris and I thought, why am I not on the show? I knew I should be on this show and I remember praying about an opportunity to be on the show. I said, “listen God, if You give me the opportunity to be on this show, I promise that I will glorify You and I will use it as a vehicle to be a catalyst to accomplish all the things that You said that I would have.” Literally, the next year I was getting a call from the casting director – the Power of the Tongue. I live by it – I manifest with the Power of the Tongue. Speak what you want – that’s the message of today.

AM: Are there things that you had to consider when you knew that you would be putting your life out there and did you think about aspects involving bringing friends, family and your relationship on there?

CDB: Yes, so obviously, I had to talk to Chris. At the time, we were not engaged. We had talked about it and he had explicit instructions on what that ring would be.

AM: Check!

CDB: My mom – I didn’t worry about her because if you watch the show, you know that that woman was made for TV! She created me – my mom named me after Candice Bergen from Murphy Brown and Dominique Deveraux played by Diahann Carroll from Dynasty. So she knew what she was doing. So that lady knew what she was doing. That lady was ready! I didn't have to tell her anything except what time and where she had to be!

AM: She might have outrun you to get there!

CDB: EXACTLY! She was getting in there. Chris and I sat down and we said that we wanted to do it and we wanted to use the show, like I said, as a catalyst and a vehicle to accomplish our goals. We agreed upfront that it would be us against everybody and that we would never allow anything to infiltrate our relationship and that we would do it until it wasn’t fun anymore. Those were solid conversations that we had. So far, we have stuck to that and we have been able to use the platform in a way that has been beneficial in our careers. I’m so grateful to BRAVO and to our production company because they have allowed me to get married on the show, truly start my music journey on the show, my acting on the show and my hair business on the show. You should come in and want to use this platform to advance yourself. Being a career housewife is wonderful, but I know that there is more to do beyond the platform and so I’m here as long as it serves me and then it’s on to the next.

AM: So, how long do you guys film for?

CDB: We shoot for about 4 months.

AM: That’s a chunk of time.

CDB: Yes and it’s a stressful chunk of time because it’s a job. You are with the pro- duction company for that entire period of time and you have to tailor your life to that time. Luckily, the show is a docuseries so they’re following our lives. Most of what we’re doing, they’re following. The more you have going on the better and I have too much going on this year! It’s making my edges fall out! The plus and the minus is that having a lot going on is great, but it is an ensemble cast, so a lot of things that are happening in your life, may not make it and may stay on the cutting room floor. They have to get equal amounts of everyone's story. So they pick and choose what makes it and we have no control over what makes it. So that’s always an interesting journey to go on to find out that right before it airs, they cut that whole story out and it’s like they shot 5 scenes for that and it won’t air.

AM: My favorite scenes are the confessionals because you’re glammed up and you’re talking about what you thought about something that is taking place on the episode. How do you come up with the outfits that you’re going to wear?

CDB: That’s always really fun! Shout out to my style team - my hair and my make-up glam team and my stylist. We come together and we decide together what we are going to do. So, one of them – sometimes it won’t be my hairstylist, my wardrobe stylist will send a hair look that she thinks would be amazing. My hairstylist, Stephanie will say that she loves it and my makeup artist Kendell will say that this is a great look to go with it. We then piece it together. One thing that people may not know is that we shoot the same look, multiple times. It’s always a challenge to find a look that is intricate and unique, but can be recreated. I’ve had braids twice now and braids are tricky because you shoot with them when they’re new and then you come back and shoot with you again in the same look in a month or month and a half and you’ve been running around in the world living with those braids and you need a touchup. But what I do, is that I have a headwrap when I have braids and you can’t tell when my roots start to show. I love confessionals, it’s like playing dress-up and you’re talking and chatting with your producer, saying what’s happening, being funny and being shady while having some champagne.

AM: It’s safe to assume that you will be back for the 7th season?

CDB: Well I think I saw somewhere that someone at BRAVO had to make an announcement that everyone was asked back because I made a little bit of a cryptic tweet and it had the Internet in an uproar.

There are just days where trolling is my ministry!

AM: It is what it is!

CDB: So yes, that was a funny day because my publicist told me that everyone was calling and E! wanted a statement and I said that they would be fine! So, I think that everybody is coming back.

AM: Like you said, you’re always using the platform to share your body of work and interests. We have seen your music career on the show and now DEEP SPACE, your debut album is out! How was that, you released it fall of last year – you’ve had over 2M streams – it’s amazing!

CDB: It’s crazy! It’s surreal because I had always seen something with music happening in my head and it really started when Chris and I got married and I knew I wanted to perform a song for him at our wedding.

AM: It was a beautiful song.

CDB: Thank you. I See You was my first recorded song. Originally I wasn’t going to do an original piece. I wanted to do a Toni Braxton song – she’s perfect at love songs. My wedding was being filmed for the show and my producer said, if you want us to capture you singing, you can’t do someone else’s song. For those that may not know about television is that there are so many rules and one of them is that you have to keep in mind the licensing. Toni Braxton is gong to demand the fees of herself, the producers, the writers and her label. That could be $40K or $100K for the show to play her song on the show and they said they weren’t going to pay that.

So I thought I would write the song and I worked with Veda Whisnant and my good friend Cliff as well as the gentleman who is now my music director, Aaron Hardin. They created I See You and that was the snowball effect and people were looking to work with me including Chucky Thompson, may he rest in peace. He did a disgustingly amazing job on the I See You the Go-go Remix – Go-go music has been a huge part of my life since I have lived in DC. It kind of snowballed from there and got bigger than what I thought it would. I knew I would put out a few songs, but then as I continued to move through the music industry, it went to doing an EP, to doing an album to performing live – it just materialized before my eyes. It’s still going!

AM: What’s it like to have Anita Baker, Nicki Minaj and Toni Braxton to bless your work? I’ve been a huge fan of Anita Baker’s work and have such a respect for her and obviously, Toni Braxton and Nicki Minaj are amazing as well. What has that been like?

CDB: I don’t even know! I have no words. When you grow up listening to these voices. For me who has a lower register, I never felt confident about my voice. Every- one celebrates Mariah Carey and Whitney Houston that has these soaring Soprano voices and I never felt like I heard anything like my voice until I heard Anita Baker, Toni Braxton and Brandy who I love. They liberated me and helped me to be proud of my voice and showed me what I could do with my voice and I studied their voices to really feel like I could sing and that I could use my voice to emote and be an artist. I owe them everything. What do you mean that Anita Baker knows who I am?

AM: I read that twice and was like, oh – Anita.

CDB: It’s still crazy to me. It’s like shut up, I can’t believe that.

AM: And yet, it happened!

You came off the Femme it Forward Tour – how was that? SWV, Faith Evans and Mya? That’s some legit superstar magic right there!

CDB: Not me – them! I’m still processing.

It's just unbelievable because again, these are Black women in R&B that wrote the soundtrack to so much of my life in the 90s and on. They wanted me to be with them on their stages, on their platforms and they respect me and they see me. That is heavy, but it’s also light in a way because I’m doing all day – that’s where I am with it. I wouldn’t be there if I wasn’t worthy and I’m just trying to live in the worthiness of it if that makes sense.

AM: It totally does! Once again, you’re manifesting up a storm. You’ve been on Netflix’s Family Reunion and being on BET’s The Christmas Lottery. The level of creativity that you have embraced and do, what does it feel like to know that it’s ok to embrace on all of these activities and to nibble on them, try them and to make it their own way. There are so many people that shy away from taking on so many things especially when they are not in the same area and I always encourage people to lean into it.

CDB: I feel like if I didn’t do all of the things that are inside of me, I would explode. It just has to come out. Some- times it doesn’t make sense and some- times I’m exhausted and sometimes I don’t know what I’m doing and I feel that sometimes.

AM: And that’s ok.

CDB: Yes, it’s ok to not know what you’re doing. If you’re following your heart, you’re following your dream, just follow it. You don’t have to ask questions – you just need to follow it and be led by it. That’s what’s calling you and you have to trust that if you’re spiritual or not but that which is leading you is coming from a higher place. That’s literally it. Some- times I’m like, “girl what are you doing and I’m like I don’t know.” But I trust and I continue and then I see the fruits and then I know why it makes sense. That’s why there is a DEEP SPACE, that’s why there is a Family Reunion, that’s why there is a Water in a Broken Glass – whatever projects I’ve worked on and there's more - so much more that I want to do in the acting realm episodically and on the big screen. I want to continue to tour and collaborate musically with new people.

AM: You’re just flowing. I always say that – I say it, I pray it, I step out on it and I just pray that God catches me.

CDB: Yasss! That’s all you can do.

AM: The rest will be figured out and if it gets messy, we’ll figure it out and make it to something else.

CDB: Exactly.

AM: Tell me about My Sister’s Keeper and why you wanted to create this organization?

CDB: So this goes back to pageantry. It was competing in pageants that led me to feel like I could create an organization that truly empowered women that were not in a position to receive resources in the same way that I was. I was a student at Howard University and it’s located in NW Washington DC. There are no gates, you are in the city. You are a part of the fabric in DC and that’s not always attractive. There’s homelessness, there’s crime – it’s a lot of pieces to that puzzle. The school directly across the street from Howard was Banneker Senior High School. I used to tudor there and I noticed that there was a lack of guidance for a lot of the young women who attended school there and just in general as I maneuvered through DC, I experienced the youth in the area – particularly in lower income areas in SE DC. I felt like I could help and part of it was ignorance. I grew up in a way that I hadn’t seen that with my own two eyes. So when I’m out in the world and I’m now doing my own thing, I realized that I had all these resources and I had someone who reared me, taught me and showed me – I said I could do that and help with that. That’s how we started. We go into schools that are mostly in the DC area and just have conversations with these young women.

We do these things called a Girl Talk Circle where we sit in a circle and put questions and thoughts into a bowl and pull them out and talk about what they’re feeling or thinking. Sometimes a girl will own it and sometimes she won’t but that’s the point. You can have an issue and not be judged. I have integrated My Sister’s Keeper into Candiace Pageant Consulting because everyone is not cut out for pageants, but you can tell when a young woman has that spark or that je ne sai quoi piece that she could rock a stage or that she could be good in this space. It’s a great way again to iron you out and give a woman poise and purpose. You have to know who you are in order to compete and it forces you to figure out who you are and I want it for all women but especially Black women because we’re not first. No one is giving us the right – it’s not a privilege – the right to feel empowered and to feel that we can have whatever we what.

AM: And to understand what the game- board is and to navigate that! And to do it one way versus the other way. Although, you might have to dig in that bag every now and then again too.

CDB: That’s part of it too. It’s knowing how and when to code switch and when to use what resources where and how – yeah!

AM: Are there any other up and coming projects that we should keep an eye out for because I feel like you’re this till that keeps on springing forth.

CDB: YES! Part of the reason why I am so tired is because I was finishing up one of my final classes for my MBA program at Howard. You’ll be seeing graduation very soon and at the same time, I made this 14 slide pitch deck that I had to do for this class, I was in the studio recording new music. I am really excited because we are going to be doing a deluxe version of the DEEP SPACE album and that will be set to come out some- time this summer! I haven’t talked about that, that’s an exclusive to you guys!

AM: I mean, you just dropped your album - last fall!

CDB: It hasn’t even been a year – I know we dropped it in Sept. But you know, I didn’t want to get stale and there’s so much left to sing about and there are so many good tracks, such good music and so much to write and I have such a cool writing team. I’m newer to writing music. My team is really patient with me and lets me make changes whether I don’t like something or I want it to feel more like this or that. We make it work. So I have been in the studio for the last 3 days so I’m finishing that. That’s done and I’ll be listening to the songs ad nauseum so I’ll be sick of that ha! But we’ll be piecing them together. It’s in the works – but a TV series that I can’t say a lot about but it’s in the works. I would be playing someone that is not a whole lot like me which is exciting and it will be shooting right here, so I wouldn’t have to leave the area which I’m excited about that! So look out for that coming out soon! I think that’s it – music, TV, the show – you’ll get all the entertainment from RHOP.

AM: Every time you hit the screen on RHOP, I’m like ok, what’s happening now ha!

CDB: It’s a mess, my God. Me enjoying life, married life and I’m still decorating my house – just living!

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PHOTOS COURTESY | PG 34 - 38 Paul Morigi | PG 41 -49 +9LIST STORI3S PG 154 Candiace Dillard-Bassett |

Read the MAR ISSUE #75 of Athleisure Mag and see MANIFESTING THIS LIFE | Candiace Dillard-Bassett in mag.